The Tai Chi Healthways Discussion Board

Maria · Joined: 03 Jan 2008 Posts: 164

Quote:

If I have one advice: learn slowly

That's what I do, and yes I agree : to be taught directly by Master Tsao is a great luck.

I work with his DVDs every day, posture by posture, and to be sure to be comfortable with one, I practice it with my eyes closed, so I feel better my balance and go to the other posture only when I feel I am not off balance with the first one.

Wink

andrey · Joined: 02 Jan 2008 Posts: 232

You guys are too good! I practice with Jesse and watch his dvds , but my form and balance are still no good.

alain · Joined: 02 Jan 2008 Posts: 65 Location: San Diego, CA

Maria wrote:

I practice it with my eyes closed, so I feel better my balance and go to the other posture only when I feel I am not off balance with the first one

Hmmm, learning from the DVD with your eyes closed?? Wink

Jokes apart, this is really good. I have found too that when I'm closing my eyes during the form, it helps me focus on my feelings to control my moves and balance. And my body feels more balanced when my mind is clear and calm. And vice versa.

By the way Maria, parles tu francais?

alain · Joined: 02 Jan 2008 Posts: 65 Location: San Diego, CA

andrey wrote:

You guys are too good! I practice with Jesse and watch his dvds , but my form and balance are still no good.

Don't worry, it will come. I found out my balance improved while I was not doing Taiji, actually. I realized I was much more confortable and relaxed hiking on mountain trails than I used to be.

When I practice a form, I try to decide in advance what I will be mindful of. Can be applications, balance, relaxation of upper body, leg strength, breathing, etc. Practicing the form just for the balance (especially with all the kicks, turns, etc) has helped me a lot.

Maria · Joined: 03 Jan 2008 Posts: 164

Quote:

By the way Maria, parles tu francais

oui Alain, je suis francophone Cool

Quote:

Hmmm, learning from the DVD with your eyes closed

first, I watch and listen sitted in front of my computer
second, I stand up and imitate the hands work and then the foot work
third, I go go a bit further, do the posture a bit lower and try too coordinate my mouvments

fourth I close my eyes and understand immediately I am out of balance, Rolling Eyes

five, I begin again from the first point..... during days and weeks Laughing

When I stop to be obliged to focus on the balance I can begin to focus on my feelings and then learn a second posture.

Maria · Joined: 03 Jan 2008 Posts: 164

Quote:

my form and balance are still no good

Andrey, what do you mean "not good" : when you compare you to Jesse or when you compare you to anybody else Question

I have also find my balance was improved in my daily life, when I was simply walking in the street.

I have also understood when I was out of balance the acupoint "yongquan" under the feet was not strictly parallel to the ground, or directed to the center of the earth if the ground is not plane, so my weight is not competely directed down and the result is a lack of balance.

Now, when I walk or climb or anything else, I think "yongquan parallel please" or "roots to the center of the earth" Razz

With time and training it will become natural Wink

Maria · Joined: 03 Jan 2008 Posts: 164

Quote:

my form and balance are still no good

Andrey

You have made me thinking to a test chiropractors use to control the balance of somebody.

Maybe do you already know that test. Question

You take 2 bathroom scales : you put one feet on one, and the other feet on the second one in the position you take when you do the opening form.

You close your eyes and you try to find your balance. When you think you have, you open your eyes and look at the weight : if there is a slight difference, do not pay attention.

All what you will probably have to do to enhance your balance is to work as slowly as you can and concentrate yourself on the transfer of the weight from one foot to the other one.

The speed (and opened eyes) hide very easily a lack of balance.

The difference between the 2 scales could be more important :1,2 or more lb even if you are not aware of it.

If so ,you know what you have to do first : try to relax and restore the balance or ask help to restore it if you can't by yourself.

Embarassed

well this just an opinion and I am certainely not a master Wink

andrey · Joined: 02 Jan 2008 Posts: 232

alain wrote:

Don't worry, it will come. I found out my balance improved while I was not doing Taiji, actually. I realized I was much more confortable and relaxed hiking on mountain trails than I used to be.

When I practice a form, I try to decide in advance what I will be mindful of. Can be applications, balance, relaxation of upper body, leg strength, breathing, etc. Practicing the form just for the balance (especially with all the kicks, turns, etc) has helped me a lot.

Thanks Alain, you have probably noticed during push hands that the only thing i have so far is a leg strength.

andrey · Joined: 02 Jan 2008 Posts: 232

Maria wrote:

Andrey

You have made me thinking to a test chiropractors use to control the balance of somebody.

Maybe do you already know that test. Question

You take 2 bathroom scales : you put one feet on one, and the other feet on the second one in the position you take when you do the opening form.

You close your eyes and you try to find your balance. When you think you have, you open your eyes and look at the weight : if there is a slight difference, do not pay attention.

All what you will probably have to do to enhance your balance is to work as slowly as you can and concentrate yourself on the transfer of the weight from one foot to the other one.

The speed (and opened eyes) hide very easily a lack of balance.

The difference between the 2 scales could be more important :1,2 or more lb even if you are not aware of it.

If so ,you know what you have to do first : try to relax and restore the balance or ask help to restore it if you can't by yourself.

Embarassed

well this just an opinion and I am certainely not a master Wink

Thank you Maria. I try to do form low and slow, so it takes me about an hour and a half to complete 5 iterations of laojia elu. I also tend to stay in zhang zhuang for 30 40 min. Still my balance is far from good in general.

jb · Joined: 02 Jan 2008 Posts: 146

Dear Jesse & Alain

Thanks for your input.

Here is my latest draft of 'Easy' taiji Yang 24 class number one:

Easy Yang 24 Taiji Class No. 1
Duration: 1 hour
Draft two by John Bouttell
Monday 7 January 2008

This workshop is based on the work of Professor Li Deyin, Masters Chen Zhenglei, Chen Xiaowang & Zhu Tiancai, Master Jesse Tsao and my two Sheffield sifus Meilin Cook and Richard Kelly.
Note: In draft one I put in a 10-minute session on Eight-brocade qigong. Following input from Jesse, this draft replaces the qigong session with two 5-minute Q&A sessions to make time for students to ask questions, as it is very important to get students mentally involved.

Warm-ups (10 mins approximately)

Rotate:

1. Neck
2. Shoulders
3. Arms
4. Waist
5. Knee
6. Ankles

Interlock fingers, hold up arms, and:

1. Twist from side to side
2. Bend to L & R

Unlock fingers and:

3. Bend back
4. Bend forward

Standing meditation (5 mins approximately)
Source: Jesse Tsao Silk Reeling Lesson One

Silk reeling (20 mins approximately)
Source: Jesse Tsao Silk Reeling Lesson One

1. Horse Riding stance
2. One-hand outward circle (ward off to RH corner)
3. Circle from outside down to dantian
4. Palm rotates at RH corner (spiral coiling)
5. Chi reaches to the fingers
6. Energy circles from the dantian to the fingers
7. Feet connect with the earth
8. Involve the whole body: soft rotation of the knee, hip, shoulder and elbow. Involve the whole body in a slow & gentle movement
9. Same on the other side
10. Coming down, the hand is one-fist distant from the dantian. Coming up, it is about 18” away from the body

5-minute Question & Answer session
As it is very important to get students mentally involved, students are invited to ask questions.

Posture No. 1 (10 mins approximately)
Simplified Tai Chi Form 24
Source: Li Deyin Taijiquan

Beginning Position

1. Step to the left
2. Raise arms
3. Bend legs
4. Demonstration of martial application

5-minute Question & Answer session
Students are invited to ask questions.

Close
With 5 minutes to go, show students how to clasp hands & bow, then:

1. Bow
2. Clap
3. Tell students that there are some handouts if they want them.

HANDOUTS
1. Li Deyin Taijiquan: The 24 steps
2. Li Deyin Taijiquan: History of tai chi
3. Li Deyin Taijiquan: The 5 major styles
4. Li Deyin Taijiquan: The 10 key points
5. Recommended books & DVDs (Li Deyin & Jesse Tsao)

jb · Joined: 02 Jan 2008 Posts: 146

In answer to Feihu ("You mention that you have been learning for 18 months and I was curious to know if you are taking a class or strictly learning from books, video, and DVDs?"),

Dear Feihu,

Yes I take classes twice a week. And I watch DVDs and all I can on YouTube. I also have a lot of books.

JB

Isabelle · Joined: 10 Jan 2008 Posts: 24

Hello JB,

Congrats for your "draft of 'Easy' taiji Yang 24 class number one".
You put a lot of thinking into it and I like the progression.

Will you at some point in the first class show the students the whole form?

I personally enjoy seeing a whole form, it helps me get the whole picture and understand the flow/energy. As the 24 is a short form, I don't think it would take too much time.
What do you think?

jb · Joined: 02 Jan 2008 Posts: 146

Isabelle wrote:

Hello JB,

Congrats for your "draft of 'Easy' taiji Yang 24 class number one".
You put a lot of thinking into it and I like the progression.

Will you at some point in the first class show the students the whole form?

I personally enjoy seeing a whole form, it helps me get the whole picture and understand the flow/energy. As the 24 is a short form, I don't think it would take too much time.
What do you think?

Dear Isabelle

Thanks for your reply and your suggestion. However, I'm in two minds about demonstrating the complete form.

For:
1. It takes only about 4-5 minutes to demonstrate the form
2. A demonstration might be interesting to some of the students
3. It might motivate students. They might think: “wow, looks good. I want to learn that.”

Against:
1. Those 5 minutes might be better used answering students’ questions
2. As a student, I would rather be learning the form than standing around watching someone else do it. I know that when I started to learn taiji, my concentration span was very short. I could hardly take in one stance let alone the whole form – after about 30 seconds my mind went blank.
3. It might demotivate students. Some of them might think: 'that looks a bit too difficult -- I'll never be able to lift my leg up like that. This tai chi stuff isn’t for me. Back to the Pilates class.'

It might be better for me to:

1. Suggest they buy a DVD by Le Deyin, Jesse Tsao or Dr. Paul Lam
2. Recommend some YouTube videos
3. At the end of the workshop, say to the students: “You’ve learned the beginning form and you have learned silk reeling, which is another stance (Cloud Hands) – next week we will learn Part the Wild Horse’s Mane.”

Then I will demonstrate the first two or three stances. If there is time, I could continue for about 60 seconds… maybe to Repulse Monkey.

Having said all that, now what do you think?
Do you have experience in this situation?
Are you a teacher?

_________________
jb

Isabelle · Joined: 10 Jan 2008 Posts: 24

Quote:

It might be better for me to:

1. Suggest they buy a DVD by Le Deyin, Jesse Tsao or Dr. Paul Lam
2. Recommend some YouTube videos
3. At the end of the workshop, say to the students: “You’ve learned the beginning form and you have learned silk reeling, which is another stance (Cloud Hands) – next week we will learn Part the Wild Horse’s Mane.”

Then I will demonstrate the first two or three stances. If there is time, I could continue for about 60 seconds… maybe to Repulse Monkey.

Having said all that, now what do you think?
Do you have experience in this situation?
Are you a teacher?

[/quote]

Hello JB,

I like your pros and cons!
Yes all can happen. Some may enjoy watching the whole form, some not.
Some may go back to Pilates or Yoga, yes!! They also may come back or do both Smile

I guess you will find what works for you and the students when you meet and get to know the group you are working with. Some may even ask you to show them the whole form. Being able to "feel" the group and answer their needs is great.
You are well prepared so this should not be difficult.

Good luck, when do you start?
Let us know how it works out please,
thanks
--isabelle

jb · Joined: 02 Jan 2008 Posts: 146

JB wrote:

Quote:

It might be better for me to:

1. Suggest they buy a DVD by Le Deyin, Jesse Tsao or Dr. Paul Lam
2. Recommend some YouTube videos
3. At the end of the workshop, say to the students: “You’ve learned the beginning form and you have learned silk reeling, which is another stance (Cloud Hands) – next week we will learn Part the Wild Horse’s Mane.”

Then I will demonstrate the first two or three stances. If there is time, I could continue for about 60 seconds… maybe to Repulse Monkey.

Having said all that, now what do you think?
Do you have experience in this situation?
Are you a teacher?

isabelle wrote:

Hello JB,

I like your pros and cons!
Yes all can happen. Some may enjoy watching the whole form, some not.
Some may go back to Pilates or Yoga, yes!! They also may come back or do both Smile

I guess you will find what works for you and the students when you meet and get to know the group you are working with. Some may even ask you to show them the whole form. Being able to "feel" the group and answer their needs is great.
You are well prepared so this should not be difficult.

Good luck, when do you start?
Let us know how it works out please,
thanks
--isabelle

Dear Isabelle,

Thanks for your reply. Regarding whether or not I do the whole form in the first session, I suspect it will all depend on what happens on the night. The workshop has been postponed, so I don't yet have any real feedback to give you. Probably the secret is to be well prepared so that you can adapt the workshop to the students' needs. While I'm waiting I am going to work on a script, which I intend to learn by heart. Let me know if you would like me to post the script.

_________________
jb